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Thread: I've got a technical question...

  1. #1
    Doug Palmer Guest

    Default I've got a technical question...

    which Olympus Europe and Olympus Japan have failed to answer for over a fortnight. I've phoned them and emailed them and they don't seem to know the answer.

    What is the pitch of the thread on the front of the ZD 300mm?

    I would like to get a solid lens cap made for my lens but the manufacturer needs to know the thread pitch in order to make the cap.

    Regards
    Doug

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    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    According to oly Jap site its 140mm.
    But I think its bigger than that.

  3. #3
    OM2n-E500 Guest

    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Quote Originally Posted by tspore View Post
    According to oly Jap site its 140mm.
    But I think its bigger than that.
    Hi Tony,
    Doug Palmer is asking for the thread pitch which is the distance in millimetres between one thread and another on a screw. Not that I understand why that is important unless it is a screw-on lens cap. I guess for that big ma it is a good investment to have special made lens caps to really protect the front element, not risking the lens cap falling off the lens.

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    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Why not try this? Send the machinist a filter that fits and have him duplicate that thread pitch.

    Carl

  5. #5
    OM2n-E500 Guest

    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Quote Originally Posted by CRHoetzl View Post
    Why not try this? Send the machinist a filter that fits and have him duplicate that thread pitch.

    Carl
    I guess the price of one filter is more than both my kit lenses together. Anyway, I think that information should be fairly easy for Oly Japan to answer.

  6. #6
    Doug Palmer Guest

    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Quote Originally Posted by tspore View Post
    According to oly Jap site its 140mm.
    But I think its bigger than that.
    Thanks Tony but that is the diameter of the cloth bag they give you to protect the lens. The filter thread diameter is 112mm but I also need the thread pitch so the it will screw into place.

    Regards
    Doug

  7. #7
    OM2n-E500 Guest

    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Palmer View Post
    which Olympus Europe and Olympus Japan have failed to answer for over a fortnight. I've phoned them and emailed them and they don't seem to know the answer.

    What is the pitch of the thread on the front of the ZD 300mm?

    I would like to get a solid lens cap made for my lens but the manufacturer needs to know the thread pitch in order to make the cap.

    Regards
    Doug
    Hi Doug,

    Just a proposal. Call your local Oly center and ask for the Sales manager, say that you are planning to buy the lens but you need that information. I think he/she will get it quite fast.

    Not very nice to con them, but come on, a fortnight wait for that information...

  8. #8
    Doug Palmer Guest

    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Quote Originally Posted by OM2n-E500 View Post
    Hi Tony,
    Doug Palmer is asking for the thread pitch which is the distance in millimetres between one thread and another on a screw. Not that I understand why that is important unless it is a screw-on lens cap. I guess for that big ma it is a good investment to have special made lens caps to really protect the front element, not risking the lens cap falling off the lens.
    Yes, I do want to know the pitch. I have only found firms that make screw in caps so the pitch is important. Although I would prefer a snap in cap if anyone knows of a company that would make one.

    Regards
    Doug

  9. #9
    Doug Palmer Guest

    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Quote Originally Posted by CRHoetzl View Post
    Why not try this? Send the machinist a filter that fits and have him duplicate that thread pitch.

    Carl
    Unfortunately, the filters for this lens are drop in filters. They don't go on the front they go at the back.

    Regards
    Doug

  10. #10
    Doug Palmer Guest

    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Quote Originally Posted by OM2n-E500 View Post
    I guess the price of one filter is more than both my kit lenses together. Anyway, I think that information should be fairly easy for Oly Japan to answer.
    You'd think it was trivial information to find out, unfortunately I haven't managed to extract it from them yet

    Regards
    Doug

  11. #11
    Doug Palmer Guest

    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Quote Originally Posted by OM2n-E500 View Post
    Hi Doug,

    Just a proposal. Call your local Oly center and ask for the Sales manager, say that you are planning to buy the lens but you need that information. I think he/she will get it quite fast.

    Not very nice to con them, but come on, a fortnight wait for that information...
    Good plan, I tried it last week. I called sales in London and was passed from manager to manager. The head of E-System sales in Europe promised a return call from someone in Olympus Japan but I haven't heard anything yet

    Maybe they simply don't have a spare lens to measure

    Regards
    Doug

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    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Doug

    As far as I'm aware, the thread pitch is the same regardless of the filter size. You could contact any filter manufacturer and ask them, for if the filter size is available, the thread pitch has to be the same.

    Cheers

    Ray

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    John

    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Google is your friend:

    http://photonotes.org/cgi-bin/entry.pl?id=Threadpitch

    most Japanese photographic manufacturers today use a standard thread pitch of 0.75mm for screw-on filters.
    HTH
    John

    -- Life is complex. It has real and imaginary parts

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    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Hi Doug and John,

    Quote Originally Posted by TomServoCA View Post
    Google is your friend:
    most Japanese photographic manufacturers today use a standard thread pitch of 0.75mm for screw-on filters.
    I wouldn't trust that info to base a purchasing decision. While 0.75 mm pitch indeed is the de-facto standard for small filters today, this is not the case for large filters. Filters above 100 mm often have 1 mm pitch in order to facilitate the mounting and minimize the risk of damaging the threads for those large diameters.

    FWIW, I have three lenses with filter sizes larger than 100 mm and all of them use 1mm pitch:
    • Tamron AT-X 300/2.8 (from end of 90s) has 112 mm x 1 mm filter thread
    • Rubinar 500/5.6 (built 2003) has 105 mm x 1 mm filter thread
    • MTO-SA 1000/10 (unknown age) has 115 mm x 1 mm filter thread
    OK, these are not exactly 3:rd millenium Japanese lenses so this info can't be used to say that the pitch on the ZD 300/2.8 is 1 mm (although I would think so). However, it clearly shows that you need to know the exact pitch before ordering the lid.

    To my knowledge, the only photographic filter pitches around are 0.5 mm, 0.75 mm and 1.0 mm. (For your lens, you can rule out the 0.5 mm as that is an old standard for small filters.)
    If your lens has a few mm depth of the threaded part, you can count the number of visible turns of the thread and measure the depth of the same threaded part with the end of a caliper. (Do the thread counting at several places around the perimeter and take the average. Also, be careful not to include any eventual thread-less part of the threaded depth.)
    - If your lens has 1.0 mm pitch, you will in average count one thread-turn per mm. Individual counts may deviate - some times you will count less and sometimes more.
    - If it has 0.75 mm pitch, you will allways count more thread-turns than the depth of the threaded part is in mm (in average 1.3 threads/mm).

    Cheers, Jens.

    PS. How much is a threaded 112 mm lid and who sell them?
    Motto: Wildlife won't come to me unless I go to it.
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    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    If the original lens cap is the same as the smaller one which comes with two pressing lip/tougue with threads, then the machinest can measure the pitch of the threads from the cap by using a thread pitch gauge ( a gauge has many blades which looks like a saw blade with different pitches on each blade, similar as a feeler gauge)

    Hope this helps

  16. #16
    Doug Palmer Guest

    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Quote Originally Posted by OzRay View Post
    Doug

    As far as I'm aware, the thread pitch is the same regardless of the filter size. You could contact any filter manufacturer and ask them, for if the filter size is available, the thread pitch has to be the same.

    Cheers

    Ray
    Unfortunately not, there does appear to be some variance. Cokin sell 112mm filter in both 0.75mm and 1mm pitches.

    Regards
    Doug

  17. #17
    Doug Palmer Guest

    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Quote Originally Posted by TomServoCA View Post
    Goggle just confuses me more, as there are lots of sites giving conflicting information and I haven't managed to find one that specifically mentions my lens.

    Regards
    Doug

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    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Doug, another possible way to measure it is:
    if you have a filter already, screw in the filter to the lens, measure the difference after you unscrew the filter for a complete 360 degrees turn, then you will know the pitch, even if you only turn 350 degrees, the reading should be fine enough, ( same as micrometer principle)
    Hope this helps

  19. #19
    Doug Palmer Guest

    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Quote Originally Posted by jebir View Post
    Hi Doug and John,

    I wouldn't trust that info to base a purchasing decision. While 0.75 mm pitch indeed is the de-facto standard for small filters today, this is not the case for large filters. Filters above 100 mm often have 1 mm pitch in order to facilitate the mounting and minimize the risk of damaging the threads for those large diameters.

    FWIW, I have three lenses with filter sizes larger than 100 mm and all of them use 1mm pitch:
    • Tamron AT-X 300/2.8 (from end of 90s) has 112 mm x 1 mm filter thread
    • Rubinar 500/5.6 (built 2003) has 105 mm x 1 mm filter thread
    • MTO-SA 1000/10 (unknown age) has 115 mm x 1 mm filter thread
    OK, these are not exactly 3:rd millenium Japanese lenses so this info can't be used to say that the pitch on the ZD 300/2.8 is 1 mm (although I would think so). However, it clearly shows that you need to know the exact pitch before ordering the lid.

    To my knowledge, the only photographic filter pitches around are 0.5mm, 0.75mm and 1.0mm. (For your lens, you can rule out the 0.5mm as that is an old standard for small filters.)
    If your lens has a few mm depth of the threaded part, you can count the number of visible turns of the thread and measure the depth of the same threaded part with the end of a caliper. (Do the thread counting at several places around the perimeter and take the average. Also, be careful not to include any eventual thread-less part of the threaded depth.)
    - If your lens has 1.0 mm pitch, you will in average count one thread-turn per mm. Individual counts may deviate - some times you will count less and sometimes more.
    - If it has 0.75 mm pitch, you will allways count more thread-turns than the depth of the threaded part is in mm (in average 1.3 threads/mm).

    Cheers, Jens.

    PS. How much is a threaded 112 mm lid and who sell them?
    Hi Jens

    The measurements from your lens are interesting; I had tried to measure the thread with a ruler and thought it measured 1mm. Unfortunately, this isn't the most accurate method of measuring the pitch.

    I've discovered another way to measure the pitch though; buy a set of bolts with a variety of pitches and see which one fits the thread.

    The threaded lens cap is going to cost ~40 and the company who will be doing the work is http://www.srbfilm.co.uk.

    Regards
    Doug

  20. #20
    Doug Palmer Guest

    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Quote Originally Posted by Johannes View Post
    If the original lens cap is the same as the smaller one which comes with two pressing lip/tougue with threads, then the machinest can measure the pitch of the threads from the cap by using a thread pitch gauge ( a gauge has many blades which looks like a saw blade with different pitches on each blade, similar as a feeler gauge)

    Hope this helps
    Unfortunately, the original lens cap is a cloth bag. If the lens came with a solid cap I would not be having this problem :^( Does anyone know who Olympus ship such a dubious lens cap with one of their most expensive lenses?

    Regards
    Doug

  21. #21
    Doug Palmer Guest

    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Quote Originally Posted by Johannes View Post
    Doug, another possible way to measure it is:
    if you have a filter already, screw in the filter to the lens, measure the difference after you unscrew the filter for a complete 360 degrees turn, then you will know the pitch, even if you only turn 350 degrees, the reading should be fine enough, ( same as micrometer principle)
    Hope this helps
    Thanks Johannes

    Unfortunately, all of the filters I have for this lens drop into the rear. They are very small and their thread pitch is tiny too.

    Regards
    Doug

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    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Oh .... then the possible way is as you said, get some different pitch screw and try it with the lens thread to make a match, sorry for cannot giving you more help .........

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    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Hi again Doug,

    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Palmer View Post
    Does anyone know why Olympus ship such a dubious lens cap with one of their most expensive lenses?
    I have no idea. These 'bag-caps' seems like the norm for 300/2.8 lenses. My Tokina was delivered with one as well. I do, see two benefit of a 'bag-cap' over an ordinary cap
    1. It provides a little bit of extra protection when the lens is handled outside its own bag.
    2. It can be fitted with or without the hood mounted as well as when the hood is reversed on the lens.
    The main drawback, as I see it, is that it collects a lot of dirt inside the bag.

    I wouldn't mind getting a screw-in metal cap for my Tokina 300/2.8. I had an OMZ 300/4.5 which had such a cap and it was really nice to know that the cap stayed put when the lens was in a roomy bag together with other stuff. A snap-on cap would not suffice.

    On the Other hand, I have been toying with a development of the bag cap to fit my needs as a wildlife photographer:
    1. Make it reversible with green-leaf/white-snow camo patterns on either side.
    2. Make it padded by laminating a 3 mm neoprene in-between the camo fabrics.
    3. Make the bottom (a sewn-in metal plate) detacheable by using a double-sided zipper around the perimeter.
    4. It should fit the lens with the hood mounted.
    In this way, we would get lens protection, bump protection, and summer/winter camouflage in one single package.

    By chance, does anyone in this forum know about any sewing workshop that can make such a gadget?

    Cheers, Jens.
    Motto: Wildlife won't come to me unless I go to it.
    --------------------------------------------------------
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    E-5, E-3, E-510, IR-E-1 ,E-P2
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    Peleng 8mm fisheye, shift Tamron SP 17/3.5, Tokina AT-X 300/2.8
    FL-50R, FL-40, FL-20, HLD-2, HLD-4, cleaved ZD EX-25 w. electric bypass, 250D, 500D, KatzEye Plus OptiBrite
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  24. #24
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    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Hi Doug,
    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Palmer View Post
    The threaded lens cap is going to cost ~40 and the company who will be doing the work is http://www.srbfilm.co.uk.
    thanks a lot for that link! A very interesting product catalog for guys like me who love to modify things.

    It seems like the metal cap is a special order item for them. Maybe we can get a lower price/item if we order two (ore more... anyone else interested...?).

    Cheers, Jens.
    Motto: Wildlife won't come to me unless I go to it.
    --------------------------------------------------------
    My Wildlife Photos: jensbirch.smugmug.com

    E-5, E-3, E-510, IR-E-1 ,E-P2
    ZD: 7-14, 14-54, 50, 50-200 SWD, 90-250/2.8, 300/2.8, EC-14, EC-20
    Peleng 8mm fisheye, shift Tamron SP 17/3.5, Tokina AT-X 300/2.8
    FL-50R, FL-40, FL-20, HLD-2, HLD-4, cleaved ZD EX-25 w. electric bypass, 250D, 500D, KatzEye Plus OptiBrite
    Feisol CT-3472LV and CM-1471

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    Default Re: I've got a technical question...

    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Palmer View Post
    Unfortunately not, there does appear to be some variance. Cokin sell 112mm filter in both 0.75mm and 1mm pitches.

    Regards
    Doug
    I looked up the tech sheet on B&W filters and they say for 112 mm filter that the pitch is 1.5
    http://www.schneideroptics.com/info/...dbook56_65.pdf

    Regards
    Rob

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