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Thread: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

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    Default Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    Last Thursday, and my first digital wedding ever. I did it as a favor to an impovrished family member. I used my E500 and I was very pleased with the results. The Bride and Groom are thrilled with the prliminary results. I had a lot of fun and it was nowhere near as odious as I remembered it, though I was as exhausted as the mother of the bride who put the whole show on! I thnk digital is a great gift to wedding photographers.

    It was a Garden wedding and Reception. The only problem was in the reception tent. It wasn't lit very well and as it got darker and darker, the E500 auto focus became less and less reliable.

    Finally, I went to manual focus and just guessed and chimped. I was wondering if anyone else has run into any techniques that would help in such a situation. Would the E510 have been any better in a similar guess and shoot situation?
    Glen Barrington
    Cheese Whiz

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    You have more courage than I do, shooting a wedding as primary photographer.

    As to your question, there has been much anachdotal information claiming a faster and more accurate AF for the E-510 than its predecessor E system cameras. I don't stress my E-510 in that regard, so I don't have any personal experiences to rely on reference speed though I do find that the AF is very accurate. However, the actual ability to focus across the illumination range is specified on P. 125 of the E-510 manual as EV0-EV19, the same as the E-1 and the E-330, so I wouldnt think it's any better at low light focusing than its predecessor models irrespective of how fast/accurate its focus is when it does have enough illumination.
    Good shooting,
    English Bob

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    It doesn't take bravery, it takes ignorance, which I have in copious amounts.

    But for these kids, it was me or no one. And I've given them something no one else in the family can.
    Glen Barrington
    Cheese Whiz

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    Well, that's a nice thought and a good deed.
    Good shooting,
    English Bob

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    Quote Originally Posted by glenbarrington View Post
    It was a Garden wedding and Reception. The only problem was in the reception tent. It wasn't lit very well and as it got darker and darker, the E500 auto focus became less and less reliable.

    Finally, I went to manual focus and just guessed and chimped. I was wondering if anyone else has run into any techniques that would help in such a situation.
    If you want to use available light, mount the FL-50 and turn of the flash function at the camera body, then just use the flash's focus-assist light.

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    One wedding shoot every 30 years is too often for me. I suppose shooting gratis for a friend is innocent enough but you might want to curb the temptation to make it a regular thing.

    I stopped shooting weddings in 1974. Never liked weddings even portrait weddings which were the only kind I ever did. The guy I worked for and who taught me how to do a wedding was a Monte Zucker fan but he didn't use available light, he toted a virtual studio with him on location. A 400ws Photogenic power pack with two heads, light-stands, umbrellas and backdrops. He always required two hours shooting time before the ceremony. Typically burning up 12-14 rolls of CPS shooting portraits of every conceivable combination Bride w/mother Bride w/father, Bride w/maid of honor ... you get the picture.

    After two years of shooting these kinds of jobs I had reached a tolerable level of proficiency. I shot one really good job which generated a spike in the demand for my work and decided to quit while I was winning. I made some people mad by saying NO over and over again.

    I suspect that wedding work requires a certain temperament, I didn't have it.

    Clay

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    Quote Originally Posted by Hokuto View Post
    If you want to use available light, mount the FL-50 and turn of the flash function at the camera body, then just use the flash's focus-assist light.
    It was WAY too dark for available light. I was using a Sunpack 383, which provided yeoman performance. But I didn't know about that focus assist light in the FL-50. I like the sound of that! Would it have worked in conjunction with the flash?
    Glen Barrington
    Cheese Whiz

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    Quote Originally Posted by glenbarrington View Post
    It was WAY too dark for available light. I was using a Sunpack 383, which provided yeoman performance. But I didn't know about that focus assist light in the FL-50. I like the sound of that! Would it have worked in conjunction with the flash?
    Yes of course, in conjunction with the FL-50, that's what it's for.

    But you could also mount the Sunpak off-camera and trigger it with an optical slave trigger by the on-camera flash if more light was needed. In any case, the focus-assist lamp is very handy, yes.

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    Shucks, if I had known, I would have loaned you my 11-22mm and 50-200mm (you don't have the 50-200mm, do you?). I was out of town all weekend, and without my kit anyway, so I would not have missed it.
    E-500 E-330 11-22mm 50-200mm 50mm
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/vautrain/

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    I could have used the 11-22, particularly for the bouquet/garter toss. I just couldn't get back far enough to capture the whole thing. So somehow I managed to capture them with two shots each. I had them do a "practice toss' which I photographed and then caught the crowd catching.

    Two bodies with the 11-22 on one and the 50 - 200 would have been good, but I only had the one body, so I relied on my 14 - 54, which really worked rather well. That really is a great workhorse of a lens.

    I enjoyed this so much, and my results were so good, that I'm seriously thinking of maybe booking a few weddings. If so, I'll need some additional lenses and at least one more body. My sister is a popular local florist, so there may be some marketing synergy there.
    Glen Barrington
    Cheese Whiz

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    I enjoyed this so much, and my results were so good, that I'm seriously thinking of maybe booking a few weddings.
    (sound of ominous chords)
    (roll trailer titles)
    Just when he thought it was safe.....

    Bridezilla vs. The Photographer

    (background pictures of famous Japanese lizard in Wedding dress destroying the Olympus Headquarters)

    Appearing this summer at chapel near you...

    All kidding aside, I'm glad you had fun with the gig. It's always nice when a gig goes smooth.
    John

    -- Life is complex. It has real and imaginary parts

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    When my own daughter got married, we REALLY looked for a good photographer. There weren't that many, but we thought we found one! A former photographer for the local newspaper. Her web site was fantastic! Full of really great photos and testimonials.

    But the photos she took for us were pretty pathetic. She worked without an assistant (and apparently without any sort of spine) and it showed. She couldn't manage to get any photos that we particularly wanted. She took no initiative to get people together, or learn who was who! I know why she was a FORMER newspaper photographer. If she took 200 photos, I would have been very surprised.

    You know the photographer is weak when the bride and the father of the bride have to start acting as photographers assistants to get the photos we wanted! Later, the two half way decent photos she took were on her web site! TWO out of Two hundred!

    She was all marketing and no skill. I have some photographic skill, some atrophied wedding experience, AND the marketing knowledge! I can do better than her. And after some research, I am pretty certain this market is underserved by GOOD photographers.

    NO reason not to procede!
    Glen Barrington
    Cheese Whiz

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    Glen, I've heard it said that this town is really in need of some reasonably-priced good pro photographers. Of course, there's the one you and I both know, but I've heard he's way, way overpriced ($1k for a senior photo shoot!). I personally don't know anything about the pro market in this town, I'm only relaying what I've heard.
    E-500 E-330 11-22mm 50-200mm 50mm
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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    Quote Originally Posted by glenbarrington View Post
    I have some photographic skill, some atrophied wedding experience, AND the marketing knowledge! I can do better than her. And after some research, I am pretty certain this market is underserved by GOOD photographers.

    NO reason not to procede!
    Glen, you've got it exactly right.

    I've been out of the business for a few years and intend to start again, probably next year at this point. Reliable equipment and redundancy are the key to letting you focus on getting the wedding right. If you don't have to worry about your equipment, you can concentrate on the job. Too many folks who try this just don't have the equipment or the redundancy to let them focus their attention where it needs to be.

    You have to make wedding shooting fun. I tell all my clients that I don't make enough money at this to attend a wedding and reception that aren't going to be fun. That's the only requirement I place on my couples!

    I meet with them four or five times prior to the wedding, and always attend the rehearsals so I get to meet the entire wedding party, choreograph the processional/recessional, and meet the person officiating and discuss my movements during the ceremony.

    After you get a few under your belt, and you're successful with those, you won't even have to advertise. It's pretty amazing.

    Good luck with your venture!

    Roger

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    Quote Originally Posted by glenbarrington View Post
    It was WAY too dark for available light. I was using a Sunpack 383, which provided yeoman performance. But I didn't know about that focus assist light in the FL-50. I like the sound of that! Would it have worked in conjunction with the flash?
    If you're only wanting the focus assist, the FL-36 has the same option - I find it very useful, I often use the FL-36 purely for this feature. I find my mobile phone can be helpful as well, it has an LED flash which is far too weak to function as a flash but if you hold a button on the side you can use it as a torch which allows the camera to easily focus with no other lighting. I've seen similar recommendations by people using a small keyring LED torch to give the camera a hand when it's struggling with AF.

    It's more difficult to use with people around although I find if I shine it downwards it doesn't pester people and the camera can still focus ok.

    Possibly shooting my first wedding in September, I have a good workmate who cannot afford a professional photographer and was going to have a relative shooting with a compact camera. I offered to shoot for her in place of the compact camera not a professional making it clear the shots will not be up to professional standard - she says as long as the pictures are framed ok, she will be happy as she doesn't think her relatives will manage that! Need a lot of practice using flashes though as I tend to avoid them most of the time.

    John
    Olympus E-1, Olympus E-500, Olympus E-330, Olympus DMC-L1, Olympus E-510, Olympus E-3, 7-14mm,12-60mm, 14-42mm, 14-45mm, 14-50mm(Leica), 14-54MM, Sigma 30mm, 35-100mm, 40-150mm(Mk1), 50mm (macro), 50-200mm, 'Bigma' 50-500mm, EC-14, EC-20, FL-36, FL-50, HLD-4, Lowepro Rezo 140AW, Slingshot 100AW

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    If anyone wants to see my first wedding photos, please go to http://glenbarrington.smugmug.com/ . I'd appreciate any suggestions for improvement. While my ego is as large as they come, I'm smart enough to take constructive criticism in a positive manner. So please care enough to be honest. I'll sob quietly into my pillow later!

    Some more self analysis of my performance.

    As stated before, I needed a wider angled lens and I needed a decent focus assist lamp. I could have used a second shooter as well, it's really exhausting doing it all. My son (23 yrs old) has expressed an interest in doing some of this with me I think I'm going to take him up on it.

    Also, I need to develop some decent and interesting poses for the old standards that people always seem to want. I'm REALLY unhappy with the cake cutting pose, for instance.

    I'm probably going to buy either an E510, or the E-Whatever when it comes out. Things aren't quite as sharp as I would like and I think it is a combination of poor focus technique and very subtle camera shake. Any suggestions along those lines would be greatly appreciated.

    Post processing was, at best, moderately successful. I should have had a firmer post processing plan in place. I kind of floundered on that a bit. I think it just took too long. I'm also having some difficulty in creating a slide show I'm happy with, I wish there was a template I could follow.

    While I think the PP issues will work themselves out eventually as I do more events, it IS an area that isn't discussed much when people talk about wedding photography.

    My sister is a popular local florist, and she did the flowers. Her building was destroyed in the last tornado we had and she lost her portfolio of photos of her work, so I'm going to print some of the photos she wants for her portfolio. I'm thinking of watermarking them with a small photocredit. I'm not 100% sure I will pursue this with vigor, but I think I'd like to shoot some more weddings to sort out how I feel about it.
    Glen Barrington
    Cheese Whiz

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    Hi Glen,

    I tried to go and look at your pictures but the address you posted is an e-mail address, not an url.

    Cheers, Jens.
    Motto: Wildlife won't come to me unless I go to it.
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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    Lara P
    A great photograph is one that fully expresses what one feels, in the deepest sense, about what is being photographed. - Ansel Adams
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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    Quote Originally Posted by jebir View Post
    Hi Glen,

    I tried to go and look at your pictures but the address you posted is an e-mail address, not an url.

    Cheers, Jens.

    My apologies, I'm too new to Smugmug I guess! I should have known better, that is obviously an email address!

    The correct address is:

    http://glenbarrington.smugmug.com/

    I have also corrected the original post.
    Glen Barrington
    Cheese Whiz

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    I think they look really good, on the whole. Especially for not having shot a wedding in so long, and for having essentially consumer equipment. Looks like the focus was off on a few of them, like this one, seems like you were focused on the background. I'm not sure I could see any shots where camera shake seemed to be an issue, but I did go through them fairly quickly.

    I guess I didn't see anything that jumped out at me saying, "the E-510 or E-Pro would have really helped here." The lighting looked pretty tough on the outdoor shots of the ceremony, and I think you and the E-500 handled it well. Were you shooting RAW or JPEG?

    I like the fact that you went a little light on the formal posed shots. You know, those shots that brides and grooms always seem to expect, but no one really likes after the proofs come in. They're obligatory. But this wasn't a formal wedding, and I think the wedding party shots look natural, light-hearted, and appropriate. Especially the ones with the dog!

    Overall, pretty darn good. Way better than I could have done, under the circumstances.
    E-500 E-330 11-22mm 50-200mm 50mm
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/vautrain/

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    Quote Originally Posted by Will V. View Post
    I think they look really good, on the whole. Especially for not having shot a wedding in so long, and for having essentially consumer equipment. Looks like the focus was off on a few of them, like this one, seems like you were focused on the background. I'm not sure I could see any shots where camera shake seemed to be an issue, but I did go through them fairly quickly.

    I guess I didn't see anything that jumped out at me saying, "the E-510 or E-Pro would have really helped here." The lighting looked pretty tough on the outdoor shots of the ceremony, and I think you and the E-500 handled it well. Were you shooting RAW or JPEG?

    I like the fact that you went a little light on the formal posed shots. You know, those shots that brides and grooms always seem to expect, but no one really likes after the proofs come in. They're obligatory. But this wasn't a formal wedding, and I think the wedding party shots look natural, light-hearted, and appropriate. Especially the ones with the dog!

    Overall, pretty darn good. Way better than I could have done, under the circumstances.
    Thanks for the kind words.

    The particular photo you mention was done on full auto focus. In fact, most of them were. I'm not real happy with the E500 autofocus results in general on these. It seems that a strong white or other contrasty object in the photo seems to fool the AF into focussing on it. I haven't noticed this to be a problem in the past. But then I rarely relied solely on auto focus, instead I would take the time to manual focus. On the next event, I'm going to try and force it to use just ONE focus point (the center point, I guess) and see if that helps.

    But I thought in a wedding situation I couldn't take the time to rely on manual focus. And clearly, my skills at 'guesstimating' DOF is VERY rusty.

    I think some of the photos do show some camera shake, particularly as the light got poorer.
    Glen Barrington
    Cheese Whiz

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    early light was obviously tough - loved no 104 though.

    later shots, and especially some of the groups, looked lovely. you clearly had the necessary control

    having done just 2 (about 30 years ago) I think I can empathise with you!

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    Default Shooting weddings.. how does one say no?

    We've all been asked, haven't we. I said no for years, then I weakened 5 years ago: No pressure wedding, older couple, kilts and stuff. They didn't want a real big deal. It'll be easy. Yeah, right.

    Aaargh! What pressure! Two film cameras, spare flashgun, tripod. Mistakes? Using flash on a cable without a diffuser: You can't aim the flash and the camera at the same time, so the flash coverage was a bit random. (Looked impressive though) In the end they were pleased. Phew.

    One year later, I have gone digital and the news has got out. Another couple asked me. I really did try to say no. This time at least I can see on the screen if the shot has gone wrong. Took about 400 shots and gave them about 190. Lots of pressure, didn't enjoy it. Mistake? Not being able to get to the reception venue well ahead of the Rolls Royce, so I missed some good opportunities. In the end they were pleased as well. (!) Really not going to do this ever again.

    The next year, it was a wedding for the family, so I guess you can't say no. I avoided the previous mistakes (see above). Results not bad. Really really not going to do this ever again... Mistakes? The waiters came out with drinks and nibbles at the reception before I got enough pictures shot. You don't get good pictures when people are eating...

    Last year I got talked into shooting an April wedding. It rained, It was windy. No-one wanted to go outside so the drinks and chat bit was inside the church under the bell tower. Pitch black. Too cold to go outside at the reception, which was either pitch black in the shadows or blinding white dresses in the sunshine. Mistakes? Saying yes to an April wedding

    This year? I forgot to say no again.... This one is late August. I have insisted they use a pro for the formal stuff, I will to the reportage style pictures. This is the last time. I really am going to say no from now on!!!

    Pete

    PS, this impresses them: Download the pix to your laptop (so they are backed up) rotate and edit where needed, and leave it on slide show during the meal.

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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    I would upgrade from the kit lens to the 14-54mm as soon as I could. It smokes the kit lens in focus. It doesn't hunt near as much and with good lighting never misses focus. It's no the camera it's the lens...
    Cosmo


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    Default Re: Shot my first wedding in 30 years. . .

    You guys are giving me the creeps...I agreed to be a friend's wedding photographer and reading all this is not comforting at all. I have never done any portraits in my entire photography time.

    What have I agreed to!!!!... I have no intention to be the main church wedding photographer but being a member of the same church, I get to access some places that an outside photographer would not be allowed..that is the only advantage.

    As for equipment, I know I am pretty limited. I already sold my E-500 and I have only got an E-330. The big WHAT if...is scary.

    This friend's wedding is going to be my 1st and my last. Let you guys know the results after the wedding in 22 Sept. ...you uncles and masters are sure not giving me any comfort.

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