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Thread: Preliminary Features of the New E-3

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    Thumbs up Preliminary Features of the New E-3

    Greetings,

    Here are the preliminary features of the new E-3 camera. (Note: The was earlier dubbed the "E-P1" by sources. But now the "official" name has been identified in photos from Korea). This information doesn't provide a complete picture of the E-3 but it does appear to be accurate. Make of it what you will...

    updated 04-Jul-07

    . More pixels and less noise
    . . 10 megapixels.
    . . "High speed" Live MOS sensor.

    . Fastest AF and more AF points
    . . Quicker and more accurate.
    . . "World's quickest" with SWD lenses.
    . . 11 AF points - all are cross type sensors.
    . . Better low-light AF performance (-2 EV at ISO 100).
    . . Better continuous AF.

    . More accurate AE
    . . 49 zones.

    . Improved optical viewfinder
    . . Larger image with 100% coverage and 1.15x magnification.
    . . Diopter adjustable from -3.0 to +1.0 m^-1 (same as E-1).
    . . Optional DE-1 eyepiece shifts the diopter +3 m^-1.
    . . Optional DE-2 eyepiece shifts the diopter -3 m^-1.
    . . Extended diopter range with DE-1 and DE-2 is -6.0 to +4.0 m^-1.

    . Larger LCD monitor
    . . 2.5 inch hypercrystal LCD.
    . . Swivel mount allows monitor to be viewed from multiple angles.

    . Faster burst speed
    . . 5 fps (frames per second) burst speed.

    . Higher shutter speed and flash sync speed
    . . 1/8000 second maximum shutter speed.
    . . 1/250 second flash sync speed.

    . Startup time and shutter lag
    . . 500 millisecond startup time.
    . . 54 millisecond shutter lag.

    . Built-in flash
    . . GN (guide number) = 12.

    . Wireless flash control capability
    . . Infrared control via 3 groups.
    . . Two new flashes (FL-36R and FL-50R) can be wirelessly controlled.
    . . Optional FLBA-1 bounce adapter.
    . . Optional FLRA-1 reflector.
    . . Optional FLST-1 stand.

    . Live View capability with swivel monitor
    . . Preview SAT (saturation?), white balance and exposure compensation.
    . . "Shadow adjustment" technology.

    . In-body image stabilization
    . . "World's most effective" anti-shake system - adds up to 5 EV steps.
    . . Supersonic.

    . Vertical grip and battery
    . . Has two buttons and two system dials.
    . . Sealed from dust and moisture like the camera body.
    . . Uses two BLM-1 batteries.
    . . Can also use AA batteries with AABH-1 battery holder.
    . . Optional LBH-1 battery.
    . . Optional GS-3 grip strap.

    . Features carried over from the original E-1
    . . Magnesium alloy weathersealed body.
    . . SSWF dust reduction system.

    One of the big questions that many of us have is: "When can I buy an E-3?" The answer appears to be November 2007.
    Best regards, FL

    Pursuing excellence...

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    Default Re: Preliminary Features of the New E-pro (E-P1)

    Quote Originally Posted by First Light View Post
    . Features carried over from the original E-1
    . . Weathersealed body.
    . . SSWF dust reduction system.
    and . . . In-camera pixel mapping
    Also, :

    Preview SAT (saturation?), white balance and exposure compensation.
    . . "Shadow adjustment" technology.

    Isn't "preview SAT" the same as "Shadow Adjustment Technology"?
    (SAT = Shadow Adjustment Technology)

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    Default About the fastest AF ...

    The part about AF seems to be too good to be true, at least for my ear. Going from slowest, but most accurate to fastest and even more accurate ..

    . Fastest AF and more AF points
    . . Quicker and more accurate.
    . . "World's quickest" with SWD lenses.
    . . 11 AF points - all are cross type sensors.
    . . Better low-light AF performance (-2 EV at ISO 100).
    . . Better continuous AF.


    Usually improvements of this nature do not happen in such leaps. Also it would make other money richer R&Ds look pretty bleak.

    I don't know, I am sure the AF will be better than previously, I just don't believe it will be as good as they present it to be.

    Regards

    Marek

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    Default Re: Preliminary Features of the New E-pro (E-P1)

    Well if they get 80% of the way toward their AF claims I'll be pretty stinkin' happy!

    I'm glad to see the the specs are up again for everyone to peruse.... Great stuff coming!

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    Default Re: Preliminary Features of the New E-pro (E-P1)

    Hi Marek,

    The too-good-to-be-true aspect to the claimed AF speed appears to involve the newer lenses with SWD AF motors. I imagine that the E-P1 will also have improved performance with pre-SWD lenses---just not as fast.

    With 11 AF points, all cross type, the AF system appears to be totally new. This is a dramatic departure from earlier E-series cameras and shows that Olympus has paid attention to the shortcomings of its AF system and has put serious effort into its upgrade at a system level (camera and lens).

    I do a lot of vertical shooting so I'm very pleased that all AF points are the cross type.

    The AF performance is important---especially with low light. But the nicest improvement to me is the 1.15x optical viewfinder with 100% coverage. This is the real achilles heal of the 4/3rds system to many pros---with such a small format, the optical viewfinder can never be as big and bright on a 4/3rds camera as it can with a larger format (all things being equal). The optical viewfinder is the primary reason for using an SLR camera in the first place. It is the core feature. So it is a very pleasant surprise to see Olympus squeeze more from the small 4/3rds format.
    Best regards, FL

    Pursuing excellence...

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    Default Re: About the fastest AF ...

    Quote Originally Posted by mxs View Post
    The part about AF seems to be too good to be true, at least for my ear. Going from slowest, but most accurate to fastest and even more accurate ..

    . Fastest AF and more AF points
    . . Quicker and more accurate.
    . . "World's quickest" with SWD lenses.
    . . 11 AF points - all are cross type sensors.
    . . Better low-light AF performance (-2 EV at ISO 100).
    . . Better continuous AF.


    Usually improvements of this nature do not happen in such leaps. Also it would make other money richer R&Ds look pretty bleak.

    I don't know, I am sure the AF will be better than previously, I just don't believe it will be as good as they present it to be.

    Regards

    Marek
    Mark while I understand your skepticism the re are reasons I do not have the same doubts which I think most people very familiar with Olympus realize.
    1. Olympus had a "E-2" ready to produce over a year and a half ago. The apparent reason for the "scraping" was the sensor was not up to the specs promised.
    2. For about at least the last two years Olympus and Panasonic have been sharing allot of R&D, patents, and equipment. So even though Panasonic hasn't been in the SLR game that long hey have been producing all types of electronics, and do have allot larger R&D department than Olympus.
    3. Here is the little part that I am wondering about. They fine print keeps saying "Fastest in it's class". Well they defiantly compare it to the 30D/40D and the D200/D300, which none of those are slouches. So it might happen that they even match or outperform the current big brothers of those cameras. Obviously though we will have to wait and see. I would personally be thrilled if they beat the 30D D200 and keep the great Olympus accuracy.
    I hope this helps, these are the reasons that I believe most people don't question the claims to much.

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    Default Re: About the fastest AF ...

    I certainly am not a person who understands the technical aspects of developing a camera. I don't really care as long as it works. But it makes sense to me that autofocus accuracy can be better achieved when the camera is shooting 5 fps as compared to 8 or 10 fps.

    The Mark III is apparently giving some people fits with autofocus. I have a Mark IIN and it is great once it locks focus. From what I have seen online, that may not be the case with the Mark III. The Mark IIN seems to have a tougher time with still objects. It really has difficultly focusing a wide angle lens. There are times it will confirm it is in focus and it's no where close. You really have to be sure you are using one of the cross type sensors.

    That's what is encourging to me about the leaked info on the E-P1. If it really has 11 cross sensors the accruracy ought to be great. Also I have no idea if frame rate is a factor in accuracy, but if it is, I would take 5 fps over 10 fps anyday if it is more accurate.

    I know from the pdf that the E-P1 is not meant to compete with the Mark III but since they would both be 10mp, have LV, sealed bodies, dust busters and other similarites you can make comparisons. Both would have advantages in some areas. If Olympus has made the autofocus as fast as claimed and it is accurate, it is certainly an option compared to the reported problems for the Mark III at Rob Galbraith's site
    http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/con...id=7-8740-9006

    These reports have certainly left me wondering - do I buy another Mark IIN while they are still available, take a chance on the Mark III or do I wait for the E-P1. Hopefully I will not be forced to make a decision like that until we have more information. It's really something to think about when you consider that the price of a 90-250mm is about the same as the Mark III, and I'm guessing you will be able to get an E-P1 and 50-200mm SWD cheaper than a Mark III.
    Steve

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    Default Re: About the fastest AF ...

    Steve,

    you leave me a little puzzled, how you are choosing between these two formats. To me they are so vastly different that I don't understand how these could be the cameras you are making a choice between.

    If you said I am choosing between Mark IIN and Nikon D2X I would get it, but Olympus vs. Mark whatever ..... I don't get it.

    Anyways, in regards to AF, surely to sustain high accuracy it's easier to achieve the claim with 5fps vs 8 or higher, not only because the speed of AF, but the whole mirror shutter mechanism etc.

    I still remain skeptical as far as this claim goes. Even considering new SWD lenses as FL wisely mentioned, I still can't see a small R&D and short time compared to large R&Ds and decades of development be beat.

    Now, don't get me wrong, I'd love to see the small guy kicking butts and I am pulling for them, but at the same time I am trying to be realistic separating marketing spiel from reality.

    Regards

    Marek

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    Default Re: Preliminary Features of the New E-pro (E-P1)

    Marek,
    I used the E-1 to make my living for two years and would love to used Olympus again. I think the autofocus is promising considering the leaked specs said -2EV, 11 cross sensors and we know there will some SWD lenses.

    If the camera's autofocus is anywhere near the ability of the Mark II, I think you will be able to compare them. My 5D focuses more accurately than the Mark II on everything but continous.

    All I'm saying is that I would like to give the E-P1 a look before buying anything else. I think both will have advantages and disavantages depending on what you plan to use them for.

    The E-P1 will have advantages like a dust buster that works, IS with every lens, better wide angle coverage including be able to use a fisheye. Finally with Olympus having the 150 F2 (which was one of the best lenses I have ever used, great for night football) and the 35-100 and next year the 14-35 F2 that gives you a trememdous amount of coverage at F2. I'm looking at the system as a whole and not just one piece of equipment.
    Steve

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    Default Re: About the fastest AF ...

    Quote Originally Posted by John_95969 View Post
    3. Here is the little part that I am wondering about. They fine print keeps saying "Fastest in it's class". Well they defiantly compare it to the 30D/40D and the D200/D300, which none of those are slouches.
    Actually, John, the quote is "world's fastest-class AF."

    From the Olympus site, at the bottom third of the page:

    [...]the interchangeable lenses announced today also incorporate advanced new features such as the revolutionary SWD (Supersonic Wave Drive) which makes possible the world's fastest-class auto focusing[...]
    http://www.olympus-global.com/en/new...70305edeve.cfm

    To me, this means "AF that is as fast as any in the world," which presumably includes the best Canikon have to offer, and not just the D200/30D class.

    I thought it could be a translation mistake, but the original Japanese seems to carry the same connotation:

    新開発の独自技術による超音波駆動方式SWDを搭載し、超高速・超高精度かつ静粛なAFシステムを実現しま す。E-1後継機との組み合わせにより、世界最速レベルのAF駆動を目指します。

    http://www.olympus.co.jp/jp/news/200...70305edevj.cfm

    Maybe Hokuto or somebody else who can read Japanese will disagree, but I'm pretty sure I'm right.


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    Default Re: About the fastest AF ...

    Hi FL. There were some more information in the "secret" table that you have missed. For instance, the guide number of the flash and how many measure points the improved AE will have. I didn't save the table, so I cant check, but I'm sure somebody else has it.

    /Jörgen
    Jörgen

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    Default Re: About the fastest AF ...

    Quote Originally Posted by windsprite View Post
    I thought it could be a translation mistake, but the original Japanese seems to carry the same connotation:


    http://www.olympus.co.jp/jp/news/200...70305edevj.cfm

    Maybe Hokuto or somebody else who can read Japanese will disagree, but I'm pretty sure I'm right.
    新開発の独自技術による超音波駆動方式SWDを搭載し、超高速・超高精度かつ静粛なAFシステ ムを実現しま す。E-1後継機との組み合わせにより、世界最速レベルのAF駆動を目指します。
    You're right, a literal translation would be: "equipped with ultrasonic drive SWD utilizing newly developed proprietary technology, it realizes an AF system that is ultra-fast, ultra-accurate, and ultra-quiet. When combined with the E-1 successor, it will aim for an AF drive that is (at, in) the world's fastest level."

    It leaves a lot of loopholes for interpretation. "Aim for" and "level" are both ambiguous; it doesn't say it will actually be the fastest in the world, but that it will aim for the fastest level in the world, where level could mean a variable range of the "fastest ones" (and where the lowest edge of that "level" is open to interpretation).

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    Default Re: About the fastest AF ...

    Now that you point it out, I guess the English version leaves some wiggle room, too: "...the revolutionary SWD (Supersonic Wave Drive) which makes possible the world's fastest-class auto focusing...."

    I'm still optimistic, though. I posted earlier today in the Chat section about how the E-500's C-AF was really "on" in good light. That gives me the feeling that Olympus pretty much already has the muscle power (especially with SWD), and all they have to do is improve the sensors so that less light and contrast are needed to lock on.

    Another thing about the wording that strikes me is, they are really setting themselves up by claiming "world's fastest-class" when they could simply say "fantastically fast" or something really vague like that. Olympus almost seems to be throwing down a challenge to the competition.

    Do you think maybe they know something we don't?


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    Default Re: About the fastest AF ...

    Hi Marek,

    Quote Originally Posted by mxs View Post
    I still remain skeptical as far as this claim goes. Even considering new SWD lenses as FL wisely mentioned, I still can't see a small R&D and short time compared to large R&Ds and decades of development be beat.
    most people seems to believe that Olympus is a small company with 'no previous experience' (tounge in cheek). That is not the case. They have a pretty long history with AF even from the pre-digital age which I'm sure they didn't scrap just because they went digital. That holds for both hardware and algorithms do achieve a functional AF system. True, the first couple of generations of Olympus dSLRs were slow but accurate.
    However, electronics generally achieve doubled performance and halved price each 1-2 years. What may have taken Canon decades to develop (ASICS, hardwired code, super fast image processor, etc.) and implement from scratch may be much more readily achievable with todays electronics and and computing speed.

    I guess, there will be a practical limit for how fast an AF system the customers need. Maybe we are about to reach that point and then it is natural that the top contestants gets closer than before. I see that has happened in the MP-race, and also in the ISO race, the competition is getting tighter. This makes me believe that Olympus is in a good position when new areas, like dust, becomes important.

    Cheers, Jens
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    Default Re: Preliminary Features of the New E-pro (E-P1)

    Uh, I don't understand what is meant by "cross-type sensors" or the implications therein. I'm pretty sure it's more than stadia lines in the viewfinder. Hopefully this question isn't too far off thread. Thanks.

    Rocky

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    Default Re: About the fastest AF ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Stuttaton View Post
    There were some more information in the "secret" table that you have missed. For instance, the guide number of the flash and how many measure points the improved AE will have. I didn't save the table, so I cant check, but I'm sure somebody else has it.
    Hi Jörgen,

    I checked the tables but they weren't helpful. They aren't really "secret", they were simply used to create the charts in the original PowerPoint (PPT) document. Many illustration programs work this way---you enter tabular data and the program generates a chart to your specifications.

    I have Adobe Illustrator which allows me to open and view the original elements of any page in a PDF document. I checked both page 10 and 11 of the "leaked" PDF version of the document that "noone" provided. I did this with both a first-generation PDF before its size was inflated to slow its propagation on the internet and the "inflated" version.

    The tables look like gibberish on my computer. This may be because I don't have a required font named "Osaka". The fact that a Roman (i.e. Western) font displays gibberish makes me think that "Osaka" may be a Kanji font which I probably wouldn't be able to read either.

    So I'm surprised that you could glean a flash guide number and AE point count from it. I can't so I could not include any information from it in my original post. If someone can provide a screen capture of the charts with this information in a readable form, then I'll be happy to update my original post.

    By the way, I can't capture an image of either table in Adobe Reader (or Acrobat Pro) because my computer is simply too fast. The tables are visible for too brief a time (probably just a few milliseconds when a page is first viewed).
    Best regards, FL

    Pursuing excellence...

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    Default Re: Preliminary Features of the New E-pro (E-P1)

    Auto focus needs a linear feature to function (a straight contrasting line), in a cross type AF point either a horzontal or a vertical line will work. Previous E series cameras have had a cross type sensor in the center, flanked by two vertical only AF points (assuming normal orientation).
    Pete

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    Default Re: Preliminary Features of the New E-pro (E-P1)

    I really think they are aminig for a product even better then the E-510 and with the new SWD lens combintions.I also belive that it will look slightly different from its depiction in current online photos, Wowing us. As far as all of this its speculation , but hoping it will be done right to suit the Pro needs and others alike.

    In the mean time really enjoying the performence of the E-510. Tho some of my photos not showing as like as they should in forum and some off hand shots does not help, my aplogies, but on my PC wonderfull.
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    Default Re: About the fastest AF ...

    I really hope you are right. But because Olympus surely didn't show us what they can do with AF speed in the first several DSLR models I will believe their claims when I see it. That's the way I am. Somehow, I think there's more to it than just a sheer of hardware speed and amount of internal memory .....

    Regards

    Marek

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    Default Re: Preliminary Features of the New E-pro (E-P1)

    I've just done a quick test of low light AF performance of my E-510 and E-500. I had the 50-200+EC-14 on the E-510 and the 300/f2.8 on the E-500. To give you an idea of how gloomy it is outside ATM I was registering 1/10th second at f4.9 and ISO 1600. But the E-510 was still able to lock focus where the E-500 with a near 2 stop light advantage couldn't lock at all. I think that shows the kind of improvements that Oly have made to their AF over the last couple of years. I have no doubt that the E-3 will be even better.
    Best wishes

    Paul

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    Question Which Lens???

    Quote Originally Posted by First Light View Post





    Does anyone have an idea about the lens in this photo? It appears to be relatively short with a fair amount of glass up front. I can't identify it. Is it merely a CGI marketing creation?
    Regards,

    Jim Pilcher
    Summit County, Colorado, USA

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    Default either 14-35 or 12-60

    It's one of the new blue ring equipped zooms, either 14-35 or 12-60.

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    Default Re: Preliminary Features of the New E-pro (E-P1)

    Hi Paul,

    nice would be if you could compare it with 30D or D200. Comparison vs. another Oly DSLR sounds encouraging but hardly gives an idea where they stand vs. Canikon.

    Thanks

    Marek

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    Default Re: Preliminary Features of the New E-pro (E-P1)

    Quote Originally Posted by mxs View Post
    Hi Paul,
    nice would be if you could compare it with 30D or D200. Comparison vs. another Oly DSLR sounds encouraging but hardly gives an idea where they stand vs. Canikon.
    Thanks
    Marek
    I don't think that any comparisons based on marketing data are correct. We'll see everithing in the autumn, when some lucky guy will be the first one to put hands on. But what is obvious - that D200, 30D and E-next really can play in one league.
    From Russia with Love,, Andrey Sudbin, offroad journalist

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    Default Re: Prelim Features of the New E-pro (E-P1)

    Hello again Jörgen,

    Jens kindly provided the information from the hidden table that you described and I've updated the original post. The following were added:

    . . 49 AE zones.
    . . 500 millisecond startup time.
    . . 54 millisecond shutter lag.
    . . 2.5 inch LCD size.
    . . Built-in flash GN = 12.
    . . Magnesium alloy body.
    Best regards, FL

    Pursuing excellence...

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