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Thread: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

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    Default Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Well, with Adobe's announcement today that it will no longer be selling individual licenses (or hard copies) of CS6 and are forcing everyone into a monthly cloud licence, they have officially lost me as future upgrading customer.

    I currently own CS5, and I am now thinking about quickly upgrading to CS6. I can no longer upgrade to CS6 through Adobe online.

    My question is pretty simple: If I am prepared to bite the bullet, go to Best Buy, hold my nose, and buy a full-price upgrade of CS6 (non-extended version), will I still be able to use the licence key to register it? Or will Adobe force me into a cloud-based subscription anyway?

    The worst thing about the cloud, is that unless you save your photos as an earlier version of CS, you will likely not be able to open them on your machine if they have been developed through a cloud based app - if you someday allow your subscription to lapse.

    Paranoid? Nope, just realistic. Basically, that's what's already happening with cloud-based Acrobat pdfs, which is only one reason (security is another) why I've stayed far away from the cloud as possible.

    Everyone, watch...ACR and Lightroom are next on the cloud frontier.

    Leigh
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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    There is talk about allowing you to subscribe to individual Adobe programs on the cloud, which hopefully will make the cost much cheaper than subscribing to all the programs on the cloud.

    As I understand it, Lightroom is already available on the cloud.

    I kind of have the same feeling about the cloud as you have, but if the price is not more expensive than purchasing the stand alone program, I will be fine with it.

    I don't understand what you are saying about not being able to open older images produced on older versions of Photoshop.
    Lawrence

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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Lawrence, you lost me with "...but if the price is not more expensive than purchasing the stand alone program, I will be fine with it." When I saw the pricing in the announcement, it was $50/month for a personal yearly license... That's roughly the equivalent of buying a new version every year. I can justify PS5 because I bought it a few years ago and I continue to use it... and the last version I had before that was PS3, which I also used for a number of years. If I had $600/year to spend on a hobby, I'd be buying new glass and a back-up body... Perhaps for a professional the cost is insignificant - - but not for the hobbyist.

    I simply can't buy-in, intellectually, that I need to upgrade to a new software application because the vendor tells me so... I suppose I shall now remain frozen with Bridge and PS5 - - I can use it for my OMD and E-30... and that should be all I need.
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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    I've heard the subscription for a single program is $20/month. But, given that my upgrade from 5 to 6 was about $200, and 6 could easily last many many years, the cloud is still more expensive. And, what if down the road they raise the rate? I don't much like the idea and there are lots of disgruntled users on other forums. I've heard that with LR5 coming out, ACR 8 won't be far behind. I'd sure like it if an E-7 is coming that it do so soon enough to be have its .orf files included in any ACR8/Lightroom 5.x update, before no new updates are provided unless you're in the cloud.
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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Quote Originally Posted by wclavey View Post
    Lawrence, you lost me with "...but if the price is not more expensive than purchasing the stand alone program, I will be fine with it."
    I was hoping that once they allow you to subscribe to Photoshop only (on the cloud) that the price to subscribe will be about the same as updating Photoshop about every 18 months, or so.
    Lawrence

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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Lawrence, because this:

    Think Adobe will be fair and reasonable with monthly subscription prices in the future? If you get irritated when Adobe purposely locks you out of new camera RAW conversion each time there is an ACR upgrade, you ain't seen nothing yet.

    In the future it is an almost certainty that you will not be able to access (other than to move or delete) your PSD files when you aren't subscribed.

    After that, what's to stop Adobe from embedding the file death code for non-current subscription holders?

    Any PSD's and other adobe-specific saves (think that won't include DNG's at some point?) eventually time out and finally, can't be recovered.

    /grumble
    Leigh
    zippski

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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Quote Originally Posted by zippski View Post
    Lawrence, because this:

    Think Adobe will be fair and reasonable with monthly subscription prices in the future? If you get irritated when Adobe purposely locks you out of new camera RAW conversion each time there is an ACR upgrade, you ain't seen nothing yet.

    In the future it is an almost certainty that you will not be able to access (other than to move or delete) your PSD files when you aren't subscribed.

    After that, what's to stop Adobe from embedding the file death code for non-current subscription holders?

    Any PSD's and other adobe-specific saves (think that won't include DNG's at some point?) eventually time out and finally, can't be recovered.

    /grumble
    Leigh
    zippski
    I think if this were to happen, there would be a lot of legal action taken against Adobe.
    Lawrence

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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Quote Originally Posted by zippski View Post
    Lawrence, because this:

    Think Adobe will be fair and reasonable with monthly subscription prices in the future? If you get irritated when Adobe purposely locks you out of new camera RAW conversion each time there is an ACR upgrade, you ain't seen nothing yet.

    In the future it is an almost certainty that you will not be able to access (other than to move or delete) your PSD files when you aren't subscribed.

    After that, what's to stop Adobe from embedding the file death code for non-current subscription holders?

    Any PSD's and other adobe-specific saves (think that won't include DNG's at some point?) eventually time out and finally, can't be recovered.

    /grumble
    Leigh
    zippski
    The solution is clear. Don't buy Adobe products.

    Don't forget, you never owned Photoshop. You held a license to legally use the software. The cloud-based subscription is no different, the delivery method has been altered.

    I've avoided Adobe products, except Reader, for years now. This is much of the reason why. The deal with planned obsolescence with and via ACR is the big one though.
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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Soon you won't own anything in your life. Starting with computer software and ending with cars and real estate - the only thing you'll own is rental rights!
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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Promotional pricing until July 31. Requires one year contract. https://creative.adobe.com/?plan=off...id=KCJNA#plans

    $9.99 per month for single app (Requires that you own a CS3 or later product)
    $19.99 per month for the Complete plan (Requires that you own a CS6 product)
    $29.99 per month for the Complete plan (Requires that you own a CS3 or later product)

    Considering that the Complete plan gives you access to ALL of the products, not just Photoshop and/or Lightroom the $19.99 per month isn't a bad price. I plan on trying it for a year and see how it works and see what the renewal pricing is like.

    You may want to take a look at this before you get all hung up on the "cloud" buzz word. 5 Myths About Adobe Creative Cloud - Terry White's Tech Blog

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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    I bought the original "Suite". When I needed to upgrade JUST Photoshop I was informed that I had to upgrade the entire suite. Instead I bought the latest Photoshop package by itself. This episode left a bad taste in my mouth. A few years ago I upgraded my computer and wanted to move the Adobe software.......good grief, I was treated like a thief. I finally gave up and just bought a new copy of Photoshop. When I went to put the new copy on a second computer, I could not get it activated. At that time, one of my employees was from Russia. He injected himself into the problem and suggested that I let him fix the problem. He (Leon) introduced me to "eMule". That afternoom every computer in my studio received the latest Photoshop at no charge. I have not spent one dollar with Adobe since that day!!!!!
    Adobe has caused their own problems and they deserve bad treatment from their users. Yes, they know how I feel.

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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    The problem is, when I bought Photoshop it was MINE. I can use it for as long as I like. I do mostly web work as well as photo editing, thus I have no need for cutting edge features, and I used CS2 for 4-5 years. Now, we'll have to pay all the time, every year. The 2012 version of photoshop serves me just fine, but I'll still be paying up in 2014 to be able to run it.

    And here's the real ball kicker - if I didn't want to upgrade, or simply didn't have the money, I could not do it and continue working on my older version of Photoshop. Now, if I don't pay, I HAVE NO PROGRAM TO RUN AT ALL.

    Imagine if Microsoft did the same thing with Windows. Miss a monthly payment, and your PC simply refuses to turn on!
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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Not sure that advertising that you broke the licensing agreement for an Adobe product on a public forum is a wise idea. Normally a company like Adobe wouldn't waste their time doing a software audit on a small company but I dont think I would push my luck.

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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    "The problem is, when I bought Photoshop it was MINE. I can use it for as long as I like. I do mostly web work as well as photo editing, thus I have no need for cutting edge features, and I used CS2 for 4-5 years. Now, we'll have to pay all the time, every year. The 2012 version of photoshop serves me just fine, but I'll still be paying up in 2014 to be able to run it."

    Huh? You can run your existing software as long as you want. They are not forcing you to upgrade or pay a monthly fee for a product you already have. Sorry if I pi$$ people off here but DO YOUR RESEARCH!!!

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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    From the site I referenced above:
    Bonus Myth “If I have a Mac and a PC I’ll have to join Creative Cloud twice!”

    Actually not only is this not true, but it’s one of the best benefits of Creative Cloud. With Creative Cloud you’re allowed to install the software on up to TWO of your computers. Just like you are able to do with the Creative Suite applications. However, unlike Creative Suite, Creative Cloud allows you to download and install either the Mac or Windows versions for each computer. This is great for people that have say a Windows PC at work, but a Mac at home.

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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Quote Originally Posted by saburns View Post
    "The problem is, when I bought Photoshop it was MINE. I can use it for as long as I like. I do mostly web work as well as photo editing, thus I have no need for cutting edge features, and I used CS2 for 4-5 years. Now, we'll have to pay all the time, every year. The 2012 version of photoshop serves me just fine, but I'll still be paying up in 2014 to be able to run it."

    Huh? You can run your existing software as long as you want. They are not forcing you to upgrade or pay a monthly fee for a product you already have. Sorry if I pi$$ people off here but DO YOUR RESEARCH!!!
    I'm talking about the future. If I want to use the latest Photoshop, I will not be able to buy it. I can only rent it for a monthly fee. If I no longer want to pay at some later date, I will also no longer have a program to use.
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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    saburns if you can afford to pay&play fine. I'm with Edmunds. Why should I pay $240/yr minimum for something that serves me (and my budget) fine for 4-5yrs?? And sure I can continue to use my existing program but what about when I want to upgrade? Sounds like the telecom business model. $50/mo. for life.

    Here's to Adobe



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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    It''s amazing when I count up all the services big and small I subscribe to, and watch them take up an increasingly large fraction of my income. Am not ready for yet another, sorry Adobe.

    psd files are at least backward-compatible to earlier Photoshop editions, meaning one can, say, do their importing and basic profiling/editing in Lightroom then any "heavy lifting" in a PS edition they already own. This at least seems to be a workaround path as new cameras are released but are not supported in the old edition of PS-ACR (probably the biggest driver of PS upgrades).

    InDesign and Illustrator users aren't as lucky. If, for example, a CS6 Illustrator file isn't saved down to the target earlier version, it won't open.

    Here's an opportunity door for a competitor to walk through and challenge Adobe's dominance. Heck if I can guess whether that will happen.

    Grumble.

    Rick

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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Lightroom, while it can be purchased as part of the Creative Cloud, is available as a standalone product, and should remain so as it is not part of the Creative Suite.

    I hardly ever use Photoshop anymore ... When I need local touch up or manipulation past what LR can do, I jump into Snapseed, Pixelmator, Flare, or one of the dozens of other excellent pixel editors available now. There's also Photoshop Elements, which has the useful 90% of what Photoshop has for photographic purposes.

    I need very little in software these days, past Lightroom and one or two of the $10 add ons as above. I don't think that's going to change. I subscribe to nothing. ;-)

    G

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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Fortunately, like Godfrey I do most of my editing in Lightroom. I will open the image in Photoshop if I have to do something that requires more precise masking than I can get with the LR adjustment brush, and use the Photozoom plugin to uprez for printing. I likely could continue using CS6 for years. I have no interest in an annual subscription model where I have nothing if I stop paying.

    But since the new model requires an application to be downloaded and installed on your computer, it seems that it inevitably be pirated. Not sure why Adobe would want to adopt a business model that gives their customers at the margin (like me, who uses the app as a hobby and not in a full time business) an incentive to use illegal copies.
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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Quote Originally Posted by olddigiman View Post
    Fortunately, like Godfrey I do most of my editing in Lightroom. I will open the image in Photoshop if I have to do something that requires more precise masking than I can get with the LR adjustment brush, and use the Photozoom plugin to uprez for printing. I likely could continue using CS6 for years. I have no interest in an annual subscription model where I have nothing if I stop paying.

    But since the new model requires an application to be downloaded and installed on your computer, it seems that it inevitably be pirated. Not sure why Adobe would want to adopt a business model that gives their customers at the margin (like me, who uses the app as a hobby and not in a full time business) an incentive to use illegal copies.
    Given Adobe's pricing for Photoshop that incentive has ALWAYS been there.

    Pity that more people don't try Elements. When I used it I found it to be 95% of what PS is for pixel level editing at 1/6 the cost.
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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    It cannot be denied that the Adobe monopoly is heavily dependent on piracy. Students pirate these super-duper expensive programs, learn how to use them, then when they are grown up they either buy them or demand them to be bought at their workplace, because they will not settle for any less.

    If by some act of God everybody who uses it illegally was forced to either buy it or uninstall it, the Adobe market share would collapse, and those students would learn, and possibly improve, alternative programs such as GIMP.

    Same with Microsoft and Windows.
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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Quote Originally Posted by Edmunds View Post
    It cannot be denied that the Adobe monopoly is heavily dependent on piracy. Students pirate these super-duper expensive programs, learn how to use them, then when they are grown up they either buy them or demand them to be bought at their workplace, because they will not settle for any less.

    If by some act of God everybody who uses it illegally was forced to either buy it or uninstall it, the Adobe market share would collapse, and those students would learn, and possibly improve, alternative programs such as GIMP.

    Same with Microsoft and Windows.
    That is an excellent point I hadn't thought of. Although, I think their educational pricing is pretty attractive for the same reason.
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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    Scott Kelby of NAPP has an interesting Q&A and comments on the Adobe Cloud on his website today.
    Scott Kelby's Photoshop Insider | Photoshop & Photography Techniques, News, Books, Reviews & More
    Lawrence

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    Default Re: Adobe CS and the %&#%&%# Cloud

    It's news like this that makes me realize I'll be 66 next week and have no real clue about the wonderful, wacky world of technology all around me. I've been happily skimming along the surface, minding my own business, just pleased as punch to be able to manage my website and post the occasional photo here, and thrilled that I'm beginning to figure out the difference between CDAF and PDAF, and some other things. Hell, I even no longer try to load film in my E-5 anymore.

    And now software is coming at me out of the clouds and I'm wondering if I still get to store my files on my local hard drives.

    Next thing you know, they'll be telling us eight-track is dead.



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